TPA-1 preview!

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kindafishy
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby kindafishy » Thu Jul 18, 2013 1:09 am

Alu wrote:
kindafishy wrote:So, is this a high gain thing, or what? Who is this aimed at? The metal crowd or the rock/blues crowd, or the clean crowd? I'll try it out when it's done, of course... just asking...

A power amp is not hi-gain or low gain, it is not even supposed to distort, unless you drive it really hard.
Having control over feedback, speaker resonance and sagging, the TPA-1 is designed for every style of music, from modern metal, to vintage stuff.


Thanks, but now I'm confused.

Earlier, you said:
Guitar --> Preamp (VST/AU or hardware) --> TPA-1 --> Cabinet Sim (IRs, Nebula, etc.)

So, it's not hi-gain or low gain, but it's placed in the same spot in the chain as 'that type of amp'.

What hardware examples are out there? Maybe that will clear things up a bit.

What would a user change in the chain you suggested if they want to do the following:

1) Have an intense breaking up blues rock sound like say, Gary Moore or SRV?
2) Have a low gain heavy tone like say, SoundGarden (from Badmotorfinger).
3) Have a high gain heavy tone like djent type stuff.

Any other examples would be sweet.

Thanks!

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Antipodes » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:17 am

The hi-gain stuff is typically happening in any pedals before the input and then the preamp section of an amp - which has cascaded tubes like 12AX7s which have typically 60-70 X gain - per tube. The preamp section is usually set up as a voltage amplifier.

The power amp section contributes some distortion but in the case of sustain until tomorrow Gary Moore sounds it is all about the preamp and a bit of feedback maybe. The power-amp takes the preamp signal and boosts the voltage AND the current and using a transformer provides the low output impedance needed to match the speakers found in guitar cabs.

Because guitar amps typically have small (cheap) speaker transformers and power transformers compared to tube hi-fi you get interesting sounding artifacts like(for example) sag and these are what anyone trying to model what the power amp contributes will be trying to reproduce.

I can't wait to try this thing.

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Alu
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:32 am

kindafishy wrote:Earlier, you said:
Guitar --> Preamp (VST/AU or hardware) --> TPA-1 --> Cabinet Sim (IRs, Nebula, etc.)

So, it's not hi-gain or low gain, but it's placed in the same spot in the chain as 'that type of amp'.

No. Maybe you've misunderstood what I meant with "preamp". Just to be clear, I wasn't referring to the soundcard preamp, but to the plug-in preamps (like NRR-1 or The Anvil, for example) or hardware preamps (like the Engl E530, Mesa Recto Recording preamp, etc.).
A full amplifier contains a preamp (which may or may not distort, depending on the circuit) and a power-amp which is made to drive the speaker. You can't drive a speaker with a preamp, as you don't have enough current to make it "move" and produce audible sound.

kindafishy wrote:What hardware examples are out there? Maybe that will clear things up a bit.

Mesa 2:90, Engl E840/50, VHT 2 50, etc.

kindafishy wrote:What would a user change in the chain you suggested if they want to do the following:

1) Have an intense breaking up blues rock sound like say, Gary Moore or SRV?
2) Have a low gain heavy tone like say, SoundGarden (from Badmotorfinger).
3) Have a high gain heavy tone like djent type stuff.

Any other examples would be sweet.

Thanks!

Nothing, he should just tweak the plug-ins.
The chain is correct: overdrive (optional) + preamp + poweramp + cabinet.
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:35 am

Guys, check the first post to download the manual.
The release is planned for tomorrow, in the mean while, since this plug-in has some advanced features, I really suggest you to read the manual carefully, expecially the rear panel controls and the "Get the best out of the TPA-1" chapter, which contains some guidelines.
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby kindafishy » Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:35 pm

Alu wrote:No. Maybe you've misunderstood what I meant with "preamp". Just to be clear, I wasn't referring to the soundcard preamp, but to the plug-in preamps (like NRR-1 or The Anvil, for example) or hardware preamps (like the Engl E530, Mesa Recto Recording preamp, etc.).[...]


Got it, thanks for the explanation. I took "preamp" to mean a mic pre, not a pre amp section of an amplifier. Hey, I didn't know that anyone was making pre amp vsts separately from power amp sections. Interesting. I'll definitely be checking this out.

Anyone have some recommendations for some really good pre amp vsts to use with this then? Lower gain, or higher gain, doesn't matter...

Cheers

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Thu Jul 18, 2013 1:37 pm

kindafishy wrote:Hey, I didn't know that anyone was making pre amp vsts separately from power amp sections.

Well, apart from the overdrives and the EQ, I've always released preamps so far (NRR-1, The Anvil, SHB-1) :lol:

As far as I know, TSE X30, LePou LE456, Nick Crow's Wagner Sharp are all preamps, if I remember correctly.
LePou has also released some of his plug-ins in preamp-only versions (I remember SoloC and HiBrit), just check his blog, as it was years ago.

Regards
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Released Plug-Ins: NRR-1 | TS-999 SubScreamer | The Anvil | SHB-1 | PTEq-1a | TSB-1 Tyrant Screamer | TPA-1 | NadIR | Emissary
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby kindafishy » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:53 pm

Alu wrote:
kindafishy wrote:Hey, I didn't know that anyone was making pre amp vsts separately from power amp sections.

Well, apart from the overdrives and the EQ, I've always released preamps so far (NRR-1, The Anvil, SHB-1) :lol:

As far as I know, TSE X30, LePou LE456, Nick Crow's Wagner Sharp are all preamps, if I remember correctly.
LePou has also released some of his plug-ins in preamp-only versions (I remember SoloC and HiBrit), just check his blog, as it was years ago.

Regards


Sorry, no disrespect meant. I hope you didn't take it that way. This is something new to me. I'm immersed in a world of amp suites, where it's all just there and behaves like a combo, so I've just not been exposed to amp components being released individually. I suppose then, that there are other existing power amp VSTs out there?

I thought that all the ones you mentioned above could just be stuck directly in front of a cabinet. Maybe they can?

I'm looking forward to experimenting with a few of these with this new plugin though. Thanks for your efforts and thanks for sharing.

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Fri Jul 19, 2013 8:02 am

It's out guys!
Check the news section ;-)
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Released Plug-Ins: NRR-1 | TS-999 SubScreamer | The Anvil | SHB-1 | PTEq-1a | TSB-1 Tyrant Screamer | TPA-1 | NadIR | Emissary
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Studio Software: Cubase 6 | Overloud BREVERB | PSP sQuad | Steven Slate Drums 3.5 Platinum | Toontrack SD2.0 | URS Channel Strip Pro | VescoFx Provoker | Voxengo Curve Eq | Voxengo Elephant 3
Studio Productions: Energy Of The Elements - Heavenly Force (EP, 2009) | Injury Broadcast - Mosh Test Dummies (EP, 2010) | Subhuman - Promo 2011 | Spreadin' Fear - Mankind (FL, 2012)

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Antipodes » Fri Jul 19, 2013 5:51 pm

Thanks for this new beast, Alu. Just what this pre-amp only world needs - some power tube muscle!

I've read your comments on matching resonance to amp type. Could you say some more about the Feedback control and what settings of the Res/FB controls are suitable for the Recabinet 3.5 setup.

Are the dynamics controls redundant in this case or are they working on a different aspect of the system?

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:39 pm

Antipodes wrote:I've read your comments on matching resonance to amp type. Could you say some more about the Feedback control and what settings of the Res/FB controls are suitable for the Recabinet 3.5 setup.

I've avoided going into this in the manual, as I didn't want to confuse the user, so get prepared for some potentially mind blowing stuff :tongue:

The thing is: feedback and resonance, on a real power amp, are strictly connected, since the feedback reduces the effect of the speaker resonance itself (without going into technical details, you can search infos regarding negative feedback theory, if you want to know more).
In fact, that's why a Mesa Rectifier, in Modern mode sounds scooped: the feedback gets disconnected and the resonance effect increases by a considerable amount, causing the mid scoop by "boosting" lows and highs.

In TPA-1 I used a trick to make feedback and resonance effect independent, to increase versatility and make TPA-1 work with every cabinet IR.

You also have to consider that tube power amp based IRs (like Recabinet, iirc), already contains the feedback effect (and then Presence and Depth as well, if the power amp has those controls), so Presence and Depth on TPA-1 may be seen as redundant, but since they're designed to give a pretty flat frequency response when setted to 5/10, if you leave them at default settings you can consider them transparent and use TPA-1 without touching them or tweak them for some additional tone shaping.

Your next question could be: if feedback is already "printed" into the IR, shouldn't I set it to zero on TPA-1? The answer is no, because zero feedback would mean a different dynamic response of the power amp. Remember that IRs capture just the static behaviour of a system, so the feedback effect in the IR is just a matter of frequency response, not dynamic response.

Ok, if you're confused right now, it's normal :lol:

As for Recabinet, since the IRs were captured with a tube power amp (please remember that I'm not 100% sure, you'd better aske the developer!), you should set the resonance to zero (or very low values for some additional refinement) and the feedback to max (or adjust it to taste).

Antipodes wrote:Are the dynamics controls redundant in this case or are they working on a different aspect of the system?

The Dynamic control on recabinet should be related to the speaker simulation, so no, it's not reduntant.

Last suggestion for everybody: don't let all these technical details limit you in any way! A great tone is what matters, if you need to use weird settings to achieve it, who cares? :wink:
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Antipodes » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:15 am

Thanks for that comprehensive answer Alu - much appreciated.

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby sjc » Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:54 pm

Seriously awesome job on this, sounds great! Tried it with the PA section disabled on X50, Crow's 7170, Ignite heads, and going to load up now with LE456.. Thanks a ton!

~scott

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby onqel » Fri Jul 26, 2013 2:23 pm

Nice work Federico :)
Developer of TSE Audio Software
http://www.TSEAudio.com

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Salamander » Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:49 pm

Hi. Sorry if this is a dumb question. I´m wondering if the effect that this plugin is trying to achieve is the same effect that Recabinet is trying to do with the "Dynamics" knob or what nebula is trying to do? I'm asking this because I want to use it the right way and I don´t want to insert the same "effect" twice in my chain.

Regards

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Wed Jul 31, 2013 5:50 pm

Salamander wrote:Hi. Sorry if this is a dumb question. I´m wondering if the effect that this plugin is trying to achieve is the same effect that Recabinet is trying to do with the "Dynamics" knob or what nebula is trying to do? I'm asking this because I want to use it the right way and I don´t want to insert the same "effect" twice in my chain.

Regards

I don't know what Recabinet is supposed to emulate with the "dyanmics" control, but I'm quite sure it is related to the speakers.
TPA-1 is a power-amp, so you're not doubling the effect. Even if they're related by their interaction, the dynamics in the power-amp circuit are completely different from the dynamics of a speaker.
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Released Plug-Ins: NRR-1 | TS-999 SubScreamer | The Anvil | SHB-1 | PTEq-1a | TSB-1 Tyrant Screamer | TPA-1 | NadIR | Emissary
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Studio Software: Cubase 6 | Overloud BREVERB | PSP sQuad | Steven Slate Drums 3.5 Platinum | Toontrack SD2.0 | URS Channel Strip Pro | VescoFx Provoker | Voxengo Curve Eq | Voxengo Elephant 3
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Hellharicot » Sun Aug 04, 2013 3:27 pm

According to one of their videos, the dynamics control of Recabinet is meant to emulate the vibration of the cone of the speaker inside of the cab. But my memory may fail me...
Is the TPA-1 now compatible with Sonar X2? I heard on your facebook page that some couldn't get it to work with it.

(By the way, I love your products. You certainly make some of the best softwares out there.)

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Alu
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Alu » Sun Aug 04, 2013 3:44 pm

Hellharicot wrote:Is the TPA-1 now compatible with Sonar X2? I heard on your facebook page that some couldn't get it to work with it.

(By the way, I love your products. You certainly make some of the best softwares out there.)

Yes, it should work now, but let me know if you face issues.
Latest version is 1.0.1, available on our site.

Thanks
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Released Plug-Ins: NRR-1 | TS-999 SubScreamer | The Anvil | SHB-1 | PTEq-1a | TSB-1 Tyrant Screamer | TPA-1 | NadIR | Emissary
Guitars: LTD Deluxe M-1000 | Ibanez MTM2 (D-Sonic + Air Norton)
Soundcard: M-Audio Profire 610
Monitors: ESI nEar 08 eXperience | AKG K141 Studio Headphones
Studio Software: Cubase 6 | Overloud BREVERB | PSP sQuad | Steven Slate Drums 3.5 Platinum | Toontrack SD2.0 | URS Channel Strip Pro | VescoFx Provoker | Voxengo Curve Eq | Voxengo Elephant 3
Studio Productions: Energy Of The Elements - Heavenly Force (EP, 2009) | Injury Broadcast - Mosh Test Dummies (EP, 2010) | Subhuman - Promo 2011 | Spreadin' Fear - Mankind (FL, 2012)

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby polifemo » Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:21 pm

Thanks!
Adds an important flavor to the tone.

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby wakeguitar » Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:11 pm

awesome job guys. keep those tips coming!

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Hellharicot » Tue Dec 24, 2013 8:58 am

Just a note for you guys: Redwirez Impulse Responses were made with a solid-state power amp, so don't be afraid to turn the Resonnance knob up!

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Fat-Alfie » Thu Mar 12, 2015 9:28 am

Mesa 2:Fifty skin for the awesome TPA-1 :cheers:

Looking at the vent slots on the front panel of the original GUI, I felt that a 2:Fifty GUI would be quite fitting :)
TPA-1_2-FIFTY_01.jpg
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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby alt33 » Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:43 am

This skin will be in dropboks?

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby Fat-Alfie » Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:52 am

Yes, it will be, when it is finished. I still have the back panel to complete.

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Re: TPA-1 preview!

Postby alt33 » Fri Mar 13, 2015 3:14 am

Why confused stereo switches and power up and down? On a real device is switched on - up. At Ignite too.

Probably not wait for more new skins? :(


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